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Traité Niddah

30a

Étude de Niddah 30a

Étude de la Mishna & Guémara 30a

Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara asks: Now consider, how many days of purity are there, in the case of a woman who gave birth to a female? There are sixty-six days. Therefore, in order to account for all of the nights that might occur immediately after the woman’s period of purity, she must immerse on sixty-six nights, according to Beit Shammai. Remove from this sum the immersions of the third week, when we require the woman to immerse seven times, and sixty less one are left. These sixty-less-one times she immerses after the third week and the thirty-five times she immerses during the first three weeks are together ninety-four immersions. If so, those ninety-five immersions, required by Beit Shammai, what is their purpose? Why do they require an extra immersion?
מִכְּדֵי יְמֵי טׇהֳרָה כַּמָּה הָווּ? שִׁתִּין וְשִׁיתָּא. דַּל שָׁבוּעַ שְׁלִישִׁי דְּאַטְבְּלִינַן לַהּ, פָּשׁוּ לְהוּ שִׁתִּין נְכֵי חֲדָא. שִׁתִּין נְכֵי חֲדָא וּתְלָתִין וַחֲמֵשׁ — תִּשְׁעִין וְאַרְבַּע הָוְיָין, תִּשְׁעִין וַחֲמֵשׁ מַאי עֲבִידְתַּיְיהוּ?
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : Rav Yirmeya of Difti says: The baraita is referring to a case where the woman came before us, i.e., she returned from her journey, during twilight, when it is halakhically uncertain whether it is day or night. The ruling is that in this case we give her another immersion, i.e., she is obligated to immerse on an additional day, in case she completed her days of impurity on the day she arrived, and that night is the night she must immerse.
אָמַר רַב יִרְמְיָה מִדִּפְתִּי: כְּגוֹן שֶׁבָּאת לְפָנֵינוּ בֵּין הַשְּׁמָשׁוֹת, דְּיָהֲבִינַן לַהּ טְבִילָה יַתִּירְתָּא.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara asks: And according to Beit Hillel, who say that a woman who immersed that long day, i.e., a woman observing her period of purity after childbirth, does not require immersion once her period of purity is over, those thirty-five immersions that they require, what is their purpose?
וּלְבֵית הִלֵּל, דְּאָמְרִי: טְבוּלַת יוֹם אָרוֹךְ לָא בָּעֵי טְבִילָה, תְּלָתִין וַחֲמֵשׁ מַאי עֲבִידְתַּיְיהוּ?
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara answers: Twenty-eight immersions are required as we said above, i.e., due to the end of the period of impurity in case the woman gave birth to a male or to a female, and due to the completion of the woman’s seven clean days in case she gave birth as a zava. In addition, during this fifth week we require the woman to immerse each and every night, as one can say that it is the end of her seven-day period as a menstruating woman.
עֶשְׂרִים וּתְמָנְיָא, כְּדַאֲמַרַן. הָךְ שָׁבוּעַ חֲמִישִׁי מַטְבְּלִינַן כֹּל לֵילְיָא וְלֵילְיָא, אֵימַר: סוֹף נִדָּה הִיא.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara raises a further difficulty: Why do I need the baraita to state that after the woman did not experience any bleeding for the first three weeks after arriving, she alternated for ten weeks between experiencing bleeding every day for a week and not experiencing any bleeding for a week. How does this detail contribute to Beit Shammai’s ruling that the woman must immerse ninety-five times? After all, eight and a half weeks are sufficient. Combined with the first three weeks after the woman’s arrival, this period amounts to eighty days, which is the number of days on which the woman must immerse according to Beit Shammai, as each day might be the last of her period of purity.
עַשְׂרָה שָׁבוּעִין לְמָה לִי? בִּתְמָנְיָא וּפַלְגָא סַגִּי!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara answers: Although eight and a half weeks are sufficient, since the baraita must teach half a week, it completes that week, for a total of nine weeks. And since the baraita teaches with regard to the ninth week that the woman is impure, it also taught with regard to the tenth week that the woman is pure, in accordance with the pattern of a week of purity following every week of impurity.
אַיְּידֵי דִּתְנָא פַּלְגָא דְּשָׁבוּעַ, מַסֵּיק לֵיהּ, וְאַיְּידֵי דִּתְנָא ״שָׁבוּעַ טָמֵא״, תְּנָא נָמֵי ״שָׁבוּעַ טָהוֹר״.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : With regard to the opinion of Beit Hillel that the woman immerses only thirty-five times, the Gemara asks: But isn’t there the immersion that the woman is obligated to perform due to the possibility that she is a zava? It is possible that by the fourth week, the woman’s period of purity after childbirth has already ended, and the bleeding she experiences that week is menstrual blood, in which case the next week that she sees blood renders her a zava. If so, she must immerse at the end of that week, after counting seven clean days. The same applies to all the other weeks on which she experiences bleeding, apart from the fourth. Consequently, there are additional immersions not counted by Beit Hillel.
וְהָאִיכָּא טְבִילַת זָבָה!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara answers: Beit Hillel count only the times that the woman is obligated to immerse before she is permitted to engage in intercourse with her husband, which amount to thirty-five. They do not count the times that she must immerse after she is permitted to engage in intercourse with her husband.
דְּלִפְנֵי תַּשְׁמִישׁ קָחָשֵׁיב, דִּלְאַחַר תַּשְׁמִישׁ לָא קָחָשֵׁיב.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara asks: But according to Beit Shammai, who count the times that the woman is obligated to immerse after she is permitted to engage in intercourse in their total of ninety-five immersions, let them also count those immersions in which the woman is obligated due to the possibility that she is a zava. The Gemara answers: Beit Shammai deal with immersions that are due to the woman’s childbirth; they do not deal with immersions that are due to the possibility of ziva.
וּלְבֵית שַׁמַּאי, דְּחָשֵׁיב דִּלְאַחַר תַּשְׁמִישׁ, נִיחְשׁוֹב נָמֵי טְבִילַת זָבָה! בְּלֵידָה קָמַיְירֵי, בְּזִיבָה לָא קָמַיְירֵי.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara questions this response: But there are immersions counted by Beit Shammai that are due to the possibility that she is a woman who gave birth as a zava. These immersions serve to purify the woman from her status as a zava, not as a woman after childbirth. The Gemara answers: Beit Shammai count immersions that are due to the possibility that she is a woman who gave birth as a zava. In such a scenario, immersion is delayed due to the childbirth, and is performed when the woman’s impurity period of ziva following childbirth is over. Therefore, these immersions are considered as connected to the childbirth. But Beit Shammai do not count immersions that are due to ziva alone.
וְהָאִיכָּא יוֹלֶדֶת בְּזוֹב? יוֹלֶדֶת בְּזוֹב קָחָשֵׁיב, זִיבָה גְּרֵידְתָּא לָא קָחָשֵׁיב.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : § With regard to the statement of the baraita that the woman immerses on every night of the first week in case her period of impurity after childbirth just ended, the Gemara asks: Besides immersing on every night of the first week after she came before us, let the woman immerse during the daytime of every day of that week as well, as perhaps she is a zava, and on each and every day it is possible that her counting of clean days are completed, and she must therefore immerse that morning. Accordingly, seven more immersions should be added to the count.
(שבועתא) [שָׁבוּעַ] קַמָּא דְּאָתְיָא לְקַמַּן, לַיטְבְּלַהּ בְּיוֹמָא, דִּילְמָא כֹּל יוֹמָא וְיוֹמָא שְׁלִימוּ לַהּ סְפוּרִים דִּידַהּ!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara answers: In accordance with whose opinion is this statement? It is in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Akiva, who said that we require that the seven clean days of a zava must be counted in our presence, i.e., they must actually be counted. Since she did not know she should count before she arrived, she did not begin counting prior to her arrival. Therefore, her seven clean days begin only once she arrives, and she cannot immerse from her status as a zava of uncertain status before the end of the first week.
הָא מַנִּי? רַבִּי עֲקִיבָא הִיא, דְּאָמַר: בָּעֵינַן סְפוּרִים בְּפָנֵינוּ.
Niddah 30a
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