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Traité Bava Kamma

59a

Étude de Bava Kamma 59a

Étude de la Guémara 59a

Guémara
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : If the animal ate the grapes while they were in the budding stage, Rabbi Yehoshua says: The court views the grapes that were damaged as if they were grapes about to be picked, and appraise the damage based on this. And the Rabbis say: The court views how much the vineyard was worth before the animal ate the grapes, and how much it is worth now. Rabbi Shimon ben Yehuda says in the name of Rabbi Shimon: In what case is this statement, that the court appraises the vineyard or group of trees that were damaged, said? It is when the animal ate young branches [lulevei gefanim] of vines or shoots of fig trees, but where it ate unripe figs or unripe grapes, the court views them and appraises them as if they were grapes ready to be picked.
אָכְלָה סְמָדַר – רַבִּי יְהוֹשֻׁעַ אוֹמֵר: רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כְּאִילּוּ הֵן עֲנָבִים עוֹמְדוֹת לִיבָּצֵר, וַחֲכָמִים אוֹמְרִים: רוֹאִין כַּמָּה הָיְתָה יָפָה וְכַמָּה הִיא יָפָה. רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן: בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בִּזְמַן שֶׁאָכְלָה לוּלְבֵי גְפָנִים וְיִחוּרֵי תְאֵנִים, אֲבָל אָכְלָה פַּגִּים אוֹ בוֹסֶר – רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כְּאִילּוּ עֲנָבִים עוֹמְדוֹת לִיבָּצֵר.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : Abaye continues: In any event, it teaches that the Rabbis say: The court views how much the vineyard was worth before the animal ate the produce and how much it is worth now, and it does not teach that the court appraises the damage relative to an area sixty times greater.
קָתָנֵי מִיהַת, וַחֲכָמִים אוֹמְרִים: רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כַּמָּה הָיְתָה יָפָה, וְכַמָּה הִיא יָפָה – וְלָא קָתָנֵי בְּשִׁשִּׁים!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : Rather, what have you to say? You must say that the wording employed by the baraita is to be understood to mean that the court appraises the damage relative to an area sixty times greater, so here too, in the baraita dealing with one who himself causes damage, the wording is to be understood to mean that the damage is valued relative to an area sixty times greater.
אֶלָּא מַאי אִית לָךְ לְמֵימַר – בְּשִׁשִּׁים; הָכָא נָמֵי בְּשִׁשִּׁים.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : Abaye said: Rabbi Yosei HaGelili and Rabbi Yishmael both said the same thing. They are of the same opinion that the appraisal for damages is based on the value of the produce remaining in the field once it ripens.
אָמַר אַבָּיֵי: רַבִּי יוֹסֵי הַגְּלִילִי וְרַבִּי יִשְׁמָעֵאל אָמְרוּ דָּבָר אֶחָד.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The opinion of Rabbi Yosei HaGelili is this that we stated above in the baraita, i.e., that the damages paid for an animal eating unripe grain are assessed according to what remains of the grain.
רַבִּי יוֹסֵי הַגְּלִילִי – הָא דַּאֲמַרַן.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The opinion of Rabbi Yishmael is as it is taught in a baraita: The verse states: “The best of his field and the best of his vineyard he shall pay” (Exodus 22:4), which means he must pay according to the best-quality field of the injured party or the best-quality vineyard of the injured party. This is the statement of Rabbi Yishmael. Rabbi Akiva says: The verse comes only to allow injured parties to collect compensation from the superior-quality land of the one liable to pay for the damage, and by an a fortiori inference it is derived that this applies to consecrated property. Compensation for damaging consecrated property is paid from one’s best-quality assets.
רַבִּי יִשְׁמָעֵאל – דְּתַנְיָא: ״מֵיטַב שָׂדֵהוּ וּמֵיטַב כַּרְמוֹ יְשַׁלֵּם״ – מֵיטַב שָׂדֵהוּ שֶׁל נִיזָּק, וּמֵיטַב כַּרְמוֹ שֶׁל נִיזָּק; דִּבְרֵי רַבִּי יִשְׁמָעֵאל. רַבִּי עֲקִיבָא אוֹמֵר: לֹא בָּא הַכָּתוּב אֶלָּא לִגְבּוֹת לַנִּיזָּקִין מִן הָעִידִּית, וְקַל וָחוֹמֶר לַהֶקְדֵּשׁ.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : And do not say that Rabbi Yishmael’s statement should be interpreted in accordance with the opinion of Rav Idi bar Avin, as Rav Idi bar Avin says: Here it concerns a case where the animal ate the produce of one garden bed from among several garden beds, but we do not know whether the garden bed it ate from was lean or choice. Therefore, the verse says to the owner of the animal: Arise and pay choice land, equivalent to the best-quality land that there is now remaining, and the court does not assume that the animal ate produce from the lesser-quality garden bed, as we do not say this.
וְלָא תֵּימָא כְּרַב אִידִי בַּר אָבִין – דְּאָמַר רַב אִידִי בַּר אָבִין: כְּגוֹן שֶׁאָכְלָה עֲרוּגָה בֵּין הָעֲרוּגוֹת, וְלָא יָדְעִינַן אִי כְּחוּשָׁה הֲוַאי אִי שְׁמֵינָה הֲוַאי, דְּאָמַר: קוּם שַׁלֵּים שְׁמֵינָה בְּמֵיטַב דְּאִיכָּא הַשְׁתָּא; דְּהָכִי לָא אָמְרִינַן.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : What is the reason that Rabbi Yishmael does not hold in accordance with the opinion of Rav Idi bar Avin? It is because he accepts the principle that the burden of proof rests upon the claimant; without such proof, the owner of the animal pays only the value of a lesser-quality garden bed. Rather, Rabbi Yishmael interprets the Torah’s expression “the best of his field” as requiring payment with the best-quality land before him, and what is this? It is that which remained in the field and subsequently sprouted, and the compensation is based on the value of this.
מַאי טַעְמָא? הַמּוֹצִיא מֵחֲבֵירוֹ עָלָיו הָרְאָיָה. אֶלָּא בְּמֵיטַב דִּלְקַמֵּיהּ, וּמַאי נִיהוּ – כִּי הַיְאךְ דְּסָלֵיק.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara examines the baraita. The Master said: Rabbi Shimon ben Yehuda says in the name of Rabbi Shimon: In what case is this statement that the court appraises the vineyard or group of trees that were damaged said? It is when the animal ate young branches of vines or shoots of fig trees. The Gemara comments: This indicates that if the animal ate budding grapes the court views them and appraises them as if they were grapes ready to be picked. But say, and try to explain accordingly, the latter clause of the baraita, which teaches that if the animal ate unripe figs or half-ripe grapes, that is where the court views them as if they were grapes ready to be picked, indicating that if the animal ate the grapes in the budding stage, the court views how much the vineyard was worth before the animal ate them and how much it is worth now. Therefore, the two clauses of the baraita appear to be contradictory.
אָמַר מָר, רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן: בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – שֶׁאָכְלָה לוּלְבֵי גְפָנִים וְיִחוּרֵי תְאֵנִים. הָא סְמָדַר – רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כְּאִילּוּ עֲנָבִים עוֹמְדוֹת לִיבָּצֵר. אֵימָא סֵיפָא: אָכְלָה פַּגִּים אוֹ בוֹסֶר הוּא דְּרוֹאִין אוֹתָן כְּאִילּוּ עֲנָבִים עוֹמְדוֹת לִיבָּצֵר, הָא סְמָדַר – רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כַּמָּה הִיא יָפָה וְכַמָּה הָיְתָה יָפָה!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : Ravina said: Bind them together and teach them as a single statement, as follows: In what case is this statement said that the court appraises how much the field was worth when the animal ate from it? It is said in a case when the animal ate young branches of vines or shoots of fig trees. But if it ate grapes in the budding stage, unripe figs, or half-ripe grapes, the court views them and appraises them as if they were grapes ready to be picked.
אָמַר רָבִינָא, כְּרוֹךְ וּתְנִי: בַּמֶּה דְּבָרִים אֲמוּרִים – בִּזְמַן שֶׁאָכְלָה לוּלְבֵי גְפָנִים וְיִחוּרֵי תְאֵנִים, אֲבָל אָכְלָה סְמָדַר פַּגִּין אוֹ בוֹסֶר – רוֹאִין אוֹתָן כְּאִילּוּ עֲנָבִים עוֹמְדוֹת לִיבָּצֵר.
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara asks: If so, the opinion of Rabbi Shimon ben Yehuda is identical to the opinion of Rabbi Yehoshua with regard to grapes in the budding stage. Why would the mishna state their opinions separately?
אִי הָכִי, רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן יְהוּדָה הַיְינוּ רַבִּי יְהוֹשֻׁעַ!
Traduction française en préparation — version anglaise (Steinsaltz) : The Gemara answers: There is a difference between them with regard to the weakening of the vine. A vine is weakened by the grapes growing on it, as they draw nutrients from the roots and branches. Now that the grapes have been eaten, the vine is no longer weakened. Therefore, according to one opinion, the court takes into consideration this reduction of the weakening of the vine, and that amount is deducted when calculating the damages, whereas according to the other opinion, the court does not take this into account. But their respective opinions are not defined, and it is not clear which tanna takes this weakening into account and which does not.
אִיכָּא בֵּינַיְיהוּ כְּחַשׁ גּוּפְנָא; וְלָא מְסַיְּימִי.
Bava Kamma 59a
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